Implementation of the Employment Standard: Part 2
Description
CAN/ASC 1.1:2024 is the first employment standard focused on promoting systemic change through environmental solutions and policies to facilitate accessibility and inclusion in the workplace. The vision behind the standard is to promote a work environment that is accessible, inclusive, barrier-free, and discrimination-free for all workers, including persons with disabilities.
In practice, implementing a standard can be challenging as it requires contextualizing and customizing the requirements for a particular organization. Enter IDEA and the development of implementation guidance to help organizations change norms and practices in their workplace to in their effort to become confident and competent in managing a workforce that includes workers with disabilities. The focus is on sustainable change through a systems-level approach.
This webinar is the final webinar in a three-part IDEA Speaker Series that will introduce the standard and its key elements and then profiles the implementation guidance being developed to accompany it. The sessions provide rich opportunities for dialogue and discussion. In each session, members of the implementation guidance development team will lead you through a brief presentation, followed by a panel discussion, and a question-and-answer period. The team includes the standard’s technical committee chair Mahadeo Sukhai, and vice chair Andrew Livingston, as well as others with expertise in standard implementation and work disability policy. The three parts of the webinar are:
- May 16: Introduction to the New ASC Standard on Employment: In this session, guest speakers will provide a primer on CAN/ASC 1.1:2024 – Employment. They will discuss the objectives of the standard and how it can help employers go beyond compliance with regulations that govern accessibility to be confident and competent in managing a diverse workforce. Attendees will learn what the standard has to offer and how it can be used to become accessible by design.
- May 30: Implementation of the Employment Standard: Part: In this session, guest speakers will provide an overview of the implementation guide, detail its key modules and explain how organizations can use it to support implementation of the standard.
- June 13: Implementation of the Employment Standard: Part 2: In this session, guest speakers will continue the exploration of key modules of the implementation guide, and then discuss related tools and resources to support the implementation process.
Transcript
1
00:00:03.690 --> 00:00:29.880
Francis: Happy. Friday. Everyone. Welcome to the idea. Speaker Series. My name is Francis Fung, and I'm the lead on engagement for idea, and I'm also the national manager for reputation and clinical services at March of Dimes, Canada. I'm filling in today for our regular host, Dan Samos, who's an assistant professor in employment relation at Queen's University, and who's also involved in our idea project.
2
00:00:30.350 --> 00:00:37.699
Francis: Before we begin, I want to let you know that we're recording this session, and the recordings will be made available on our idea website.
3
00:00:38.580 --> 00:00:46.130
Francis: Today we have closed caption and French interpretations available for you. You should be able to find it in the Zoom Platform.
4
00:00:46.840 --> 00:01:05.989
Francis: For those of you who may not know much about idea. It is a social innovation laboratory, focused on helping create stronger and more diverse labor markets that include persons with disabilities through knowledge. To practice idea is the acronym for inclusive design for employment access.
5
00:01:06.640 --> 00:01:13.710
Francis: Before we start. I'd like to share a land acknowledgement relevant to the idea. National Office in Toronto.
6
00:01:13.900 --> 00:01:37.520
Francis: where the National office of the Idea Social Innovation Laboratory is situated has for thousands of years been the traditional land of the Huron, Wendet, the Seneca, and most recently the Mississaugas of the Credit. Today this land is still home to many indigenous people from across Turtle Island, and we are grateful to have the opportunity to conduct our work on it.
7
00:01:38.250 --> 00:01:48.420
Francis: This acknowledgement is relevant to Toronto, however, because we are gathered for this meeting. Virtually we suggest you think about the communities in your respective locations as well.
8
00:01:49.540 --> 00:02:01.699
Francis: This Monthly Speaker Series serves as an opportunity to hear the latest about current topics in the work, disability policy arena and learn about activities underway, within and beyond idea.
9
00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:08.489
Francis: Today we will start with a presentation, and then followed by questions from the panel that we have today.
10
00:02:08.639 --> 00:02:18.910
Francis: You can type your questions in the Q&A box at any time throughout the presentation, and we'll try to answer as many questions as possible at the end of the webinar.
11
00:02:20.390 --> 00:02:29.920
Francis: This is our 3rd webinar focus on the accessibility standards, Canada employment standards and the implementation guidance. That idea is developing.
12
00:02:30.420 --> 00:02:35.009
Francis: Our presenters for today are all on the implementation guidance team.
13
00:02:35.140 --> 00:02:38.999
Francis: We have Dr. Emil, Tompa, Peter Field, and Andy Livingston.
14
00:02:39.840 --> 00:02:50.419
Francis: Emil Tompa is the executive director of idea. He's also a senior scientist at the Institute for Work and Health, and an associate professor at Mcmaster University.
15
00:02:51.160 --> 00:03:01.509
Francis: Peter Field is a consultant in the area on human resources, inclusion, access to library systems for persons with disabilities and safe sports.
16
00:03:01.680 --> 00:03:10.950
Francis: In 2019 he retired from a 28 year career in the Federal public services, with the last 12 years working at the director level.
17
00:03:11.930 --> 00:03:31.870
Francis: Andy Liftingstone is the CEO of dexterity consulting. He's passionate about dispute, resolution accessible for all his expertise and mediation skills and work on accessibility and accommodation issues are highly sought after. He also has experience in curriculum development.
18
00:03:32.430 --> 00:03:36.020
Francis: So welcome Emil, Peter and Andy, and over to you.
19
00:03:36.490 --> 00:03:52.719
Emile Tompa: Okay, thanks, Francis, for that introduction, and, as Francis mentioned, I'll start off with a a short presentation before we get into a bit of a panel discussion, just to give you some background about the the work we're doing. And then that'll be the platform for our discussion as well. So
20
00:03:52.740 --> 00:04:21.889
Emile Tompa: the the employment standard guidance that we're developing is going to be titled employment, accessibility, a practical guide for workplace parties, right? And it it is based on providing some guidance for for the accessibility standards. Canada standard on employment which had a version released. Just this past month. The 1st version was out in the fall of last year, and an updated version was released last month.
21
00:04:22.795 --> 00:04:32.469
Emile Tompa: And I provide links in the subsequent slide. We have listed here. The the folks that that are involved in in the implementation guidance on this next slide.
22
00:04:32.892 --> 00:04:53.150
Emile Tompa: A bit more detail about our team. So a great team of diverse expertise coming to the table, a number of us who are actually part of the development of the standard. We sit on the the technical committee, the standard, and so affiliations are listed here.
23
00:04:54.830 --> 00:05:12.509
Emile Tompa: So the project team includes accessibility experts from different disciplines, some of whom are also persons with lived experiences, members, include policy advisors, human resource, expertise systems, thinkers and academics who have worked in this space for for quite a number of years, including myself.
24
00:05:12.890 --> 00:05:18.290
Emile Tompa: Several of the team members, as I mentioned, have also been involved in the Employment Standards Technical Committee.
25
00:05:19.140 --> 00:05:48.260
Emile Tompa: so the standard itself is called the employment standard. The details are listed on this slide. As I mentioned, a revised version of it was released in May. The link is provided here as well, and the standard is a really cutting edge standard, the 1st of its kind in the world. It really envisions a work environment that is accessible, inclusive barrier, free discrimination, free for all workers, including persons with disabilities.
26
00:05:48.310 --> 00:06:14.639
Emile Tompa: And it draws on the social model of disability. So we're trying to take it away from medicalization of disability, more towards thinking about the environment that we have in workplaces and in our communities and in the world more generally, and thinking about how we can take down those barriers so that everybody can participate actively and be, you know, integral members of organizations in the world of work.
27
00:06:14.960 --> 00:06:35.759
Emile Tompa: So it really does focus on removing those barriers and providing accommodations, and not always with a need for disclosure, really thinking about, how can we make the world inclusive work, the world of work inclusive by design, so that there's not always a requirement to disclose, you know, because it's it's inclusive from 1st principles.
28
00:06:37.298 --> 00:06:49.939
Emile Tompa: This is a list of all the technical committee members. I really want to give them kudos. It's a great fabulous team that I've been involved with actively for for a number of years. There's all kinds of expertise on this committee. So I want to just give them
29
00:06:50.349 --> 00:07:02.790
Emile Tompa: some air time, because sometimes you forget about who's behind the scenes working on this. But there was. It was a really fabulous team, and we continue to work together. Up until the the last release of of the standard. That's up.
30
00:07:02.920 --> 00:07:03.900
Emile Tompa: Currently
31
00:07:05.520 --> 00:07:26.929
Emile Tompa: the core modules of the standard. If you haven't had a chance to look at it. There are listed here. There's 5 core modules or clauses that we call them clause 10 is about structural supports and policy and leadership. Clause 11 is about culture, engagement and education. Clause 12 is about recruitment hiring and onboarding.
32
00:07:27.337 --> 00:07:42.010
Emile Tompa: Clause 13 is about retention and career development. So those 2 chapters together look at the entire employment journey of persons with disabilities in a particular organization to make sure that that entire experience is inclusive.
33
00:07:42.270 --> 00:07:50.770
Emile Tompa: and then, in chapter 14 is about development and maintenance of accessibility support systems. So again, the link for the for the standard is there as well.
34
00:07:51.030 --> 00:08:10.330
Emile Tompa: Now, why is implementation guides needed right in general standards describe the set of requirements that an organization needs to have in place to meet certain expectations. That is the essence of what the standard is about. And in this case it's about being an inclusive employer employer.
35
00:08:10.370 --> 00:08:35.879
Emile Tompa: whereas implementation, guidance provides advice on the process to to achieve the requirements of the standard. So in kind of a everyday language, you think, tend to think of it as being fixed standard being the what, and and then the implementation guidance about being the how. So the what is the standard? The implementation guys helps you get to complete compliance with that standard. So it's the how to how to kind of process.
36
00:08:36.039 --> 00:09:01.790
Emile Tompa: And in general, standards are in quite broadly. And so they're meant to be applicable to a large constituency of in this case. Organizations across Canada, regardless of whether they're federally regulated, provincially regulated. You know, private sector, public sector, small, large, whatever sector it is in. So it's quite broadly scoped. So the guidance really assists with contextualizing requirements for a particular organization.
37
00:09:01.810 --> 00:09:26.259
Emile Tompa: So the guide that we're developing is being designed to support implementation of the standard in different contexts. So we need, we're very cognizant of the fact that different organizations may be in a different situation, not just because of the sector or their size, but they might have done a lot of things already in this space and are starting off at a different point than maybe other organizations. So we it really helps you contextualize and figure out, well, how do I use them.
38
00:09:26.652 --> 00:09:38.429
Emile Tompa: This standard to to become inclusive by design given where we're at. Currently. So the pro, the implementation process will invariably vary, based on the unique circumstances of an organization.
39
00:09:39.350 --> 00:10:05.639
Emile Tompa: The core modules of our guidance are listed here. There's 5 of them. The 1st one is about developing an employment accessibility, strategy, strategizing, planning, looking ahead and thinking of what that journey should look like is a good starting point and then creating a new normal through leadership and culture, culture comes up a lot is really critical, and then we go into inclusive recruitment, hiring and onboarding, followed by inclusive retention, promotion, and career development.
40
00:10:05.690 --> 00:10:09.680
Emile Tompa: and then finally creating and maintaining an accessibility support system.
41
00:10:10.190 --> 00:10:36.990
Emile Tompa: Emphasis is really given to measurement, evaluation and reporting absolutely critical to know where you're at and where you're going and what progress you're making measurement. Evaluation is absolutely critical. Reporting is also important in some cases for for regulatory requirements and and as well as keeping up with accessibility. Compliance in your in general, within your jurisdictions, you know, helps with the reporting of of where you're at and what you're working towards.
42
00:10:38.380 --> 00:10:44.650
Emile Tompa: There's some other modules in the guidance as well. So there's 1 on inclusive technology and communications. A critical
43
00:10:45.000 --> 00:10:58.069
Emile Tompa: challenge is making sure that technology and communications more broadly are accessible for everybody within the organization removing barriers and then accessibility, compliance, and best practices. So that's the reporting part of it.
44
00:10:58.480 --> 00:11:15.000
Emile Tompa: So this guy will also have a module describing key concepts. We also have some annexes with supplementary information on tools and resources to support implementation so critical pieces that might help, you know, with the implementation might be things such as audit tools, you know.
45
00:11:15.000 --> 00:11:32.080
Emile Tompa: ways to do, a really good internal scan of your organization, the kinds of questions you should be asking folks and data you should be collecting to to get a better handle on where the key gaps are within your organization. So we'll be putting a bunch of resources in these annexes to help support the process.
46
00:11:33.520 --> 00:11:53.829
Emile Tompa: So we take a systems level approach to capacity building in in our implementation guidance. And it's also woven into obviously how the standard has been written, because traditionally, maybe, the approach used to address disability inclusion issues within organizations has been about assigning it to a particular person or a team responsible for it within human resources
47
00:11:53.980 --> 00:12:22.909
Emile Tompa: and organizations often have taken a reactive approach to accommodation needs only addressing them when requests are made. That's like a reactive approach addressing things when they become a challenge and a problem for a person or an organization, whereas the systems approach is really meant to be proactive, you know, considering all the roles and responsibilities across the organization, it considers inputs process, outputs and feedback
48
00:12:22.910 --> 00:12:28.809
Emile Tompa: and evaluation. Improvement on a continual basis are really critical parts of a systems level approach.
49
00:12:29.030 --> 00:12:45.660
Emile Tompa: And in the disability inclusion space it's intended to ultimately help an organization become inclusive by design, by building the structures, creating new normals. So that your way of operating is different and always taking that disability, inclusion, and throughout everything the organization does.
50
00:12:47.250 --> 00:13:04.210
Emile Tompa: So just a little bit more detail about how the management system model works. You start off with policies which play a fundamental role in really setting clear directions for organizations to follow. So policies are essential framework or skeleton of the organization's operational type activities.
51
00:13:04.510 --> 00:13:12.189
Emile Tompa: Management structures need to be put into place to deliver on those policies. So that's where some of the roles and responsibilities get clarified.
52
00:13:12.430 --> 00:13:23.119
Emile Tompa: And then it requires planning and a systematic approach to implementing those policies. So to be sure that they they're actually put into practice in the day-to-day activities within the organization.
53
00:13:23.700 --> 00:13:40.400
Emile Tompa: Emphasis is really given, as I've mentioned already, on measurement of performance against targets to identify areas where that need improvement. The only way you know where the gaps are is by doing some measurement, evaluation, scanning the environment of your workplace to see where there are challenges that need to be addressed.
54
00:13:40.810 --> 00:13:56.900
Emile Tompa: and then review and learning from those experiences when you go through a cycle of trying to improve things you learn from that. You see, you figure out where we've set some goals. We've achieved them. What else can we think of to work on in the next round? That's where the continual improvement process comes into play.
55
00:13:57.690 --> 00:14:14.829
Emile Tompa: So continual improvement as you get you're getting a sense of is a really central part of how we're framing our implementation guidance. It's a real center piece where systems change is done through a continual improvement process because it's a journey. Actually, it doesn't happen all at once. You know, you may be starting off
56
00:14:14.870 --> 00:14:28.860
Emile Tompa: on this journey with a lot of things to get done, and it can't be done all at once. So you have to prioritize and think about what are we going to do in a particular cycle. So continual improvement is really an ongoing effort to refine a particular area of organizational activities through
57
00:14:28.860 --> 00:14:50.030
Emile Tompa: periodic cycles and specifically thinking in each cycle, you would think about developing plans and targets for that cycle. You implement those plans you measure and evaluate to make sure you're achieving the goals outcomes that you've set for you in that particular cycle. And then acting on findings of the evaluation to ensure those targets are ultimately being met
58
00:14:50.030 --> 00:15:11.260
Emile Tompa: before you can think about. Okay, that we've got this done. What else can we do in a subsequent round? So that's often framed as a plan? Do check act approach. That's an acronym Pdca that's often used in the world of continual improvement. And it's a common approach to operationalizing that notion of continual improvement processes
59
00:15:11.870 --> 00:15:32.299
Emile Tompa: and a bit more about continual improvement cycles. You see a diagram here with the the plan, do Check Act. Which of the plan is about establishing improvement objectives. The do is about implementing the plan. The check is about monitor monitoring and evaluating progress. And then the act is about reviewing and taking action to approve
60
00:15:32.360 --> 00:15:41.532
Emile Tompa: in those areas where you haven't quite met the targets you set set out to do so. An example of of review considerations in this particular space is
61
00:15:41.860 --> 00:16:08.210
Emile Tompa: do do current recruitment, hiring and onboarding practices provide opportunities for all persons with different types of disabilities to access employment opportunities within the organization, so that that might be something you you want to consider at the front end. If if you're just starting off in the journey, think of is our recruitment process inclusive. And then what policies and procedures, roles and responsibilities and resources and skills need to be in place to ensure inclusive practices in the recruitment process?
62
00:16:09.370 --> 00:16:33.159
Emile Tompa: Okay? And the next steps for for implementation guidance is that we are looking to get a beta draft out of this guidance for public review in the early summer. So so that's our target to have something out there that we can get some feedback on hopefully in this beta draft, which we will then take that feedback and review it, and fine tune the guidance with ideally the hope to finalize guidance by the late summer.
63
00:16:34.450 --> 00:16:49.869
Emile Tompa: And I just want to acknowledge that this initiative of the implementation guidance is being funded by idea which we get our core funding from the government of Canada and specifically new frontiers in Research fund the transformation stream who has funded us for a period of 7 years.
64
00:16:51.400 --> 00:16:56.299
Emile Tompa: And that's it for my presentation. So maybe we can move on to a panel discussion.
65
00:17:00.390 --> 00:17:23.792
Francis: Well, thank you, Emil. For the the information presented. So we're gonna move into the panel discussions now, and there have been some questions submitted. So maybe we can go through the questions one by one, and then, and the the presenters and the panelists here can't answered, interns.
66
00:17:24.390 --> 00:17:29.809
Francis: So the 1st question we have here is that you? You presented a a guidance
67
00:17:30.693 --> 00:17:42.780
Francis: for the employment standards, and the questions related to whether the guidance would be different, for small and medium sized employers versus the larger ones.
68
00:17:46.330 --> 00:17:47.670
Emile Tompa: Did you want to go first.st
69
00:17:47.940 --> 00:18:05.149
Peter: Yeah, I can. I can answer that one. So the short answer is, yes. I think the important thing to remember here, based on what Emil presented is you can't do everything at once right, or it'll be very difficult to do everything at once. So we've kind of
70
00:18:05.300 --> 00:18:07.059
Peter: worked at the
71
00:18:07.090 --> 00:18:30.280
Peter: the guidance from that point and the the actual document. So it starts off by doing a scan to see you know where exactly you need to do the work and then doing some planning from there. Now that that relates obviously to the size of the organization, right? If you've if you're a large organization, you've got lots of resources. A big Hr team behind you.
72
00:18:30.280 --> 00:18:54.339
Peter: a strong management team. Then you might. You might tackle a number of different things at the beginning. But if you're a smaller organization and you find out in your scan well, there's really only 2 or 3 things that we need to do here. Then you try, probably try to approach it differently. So it it would be approached differently, depending on the size of your organization. But that
73
00:18:54.340 --> 00:19:01.030
Peter: initial scan is really important to determine where, where are the gaps? And and how do we want to plan to start.
74
00:19:01.280 --> 00:19:09.939
Emile Tompa: Yeah, I I totally agree. Actually, I mean, size is an important consideration. But I think there's other variables as well. Each organization is in unique place.
75
00:19:10.260 --> 00:19:32.550
Emile Tompa: it may be sector, you know it. It may be you're you're a not for profit, you know. You maybe for profit, different geographies. So through the labor market that that you're confronting it may be different as well. So I I think context is absolutely critical thing to take into consideration because each organization is unique, and the journey that they will take to to
76
00:19:32.610 --> 00:19:51.630
Emile Tompa: implementing the standard and becoming inclusive by design will be distinct, based on where they're currently at. And they're both their their situational characteristics. Some organization may have done quite a bit of work in this space and are starting the formality of implementing the guidance, the standard in a different spot. And and
77
00:19:51.630 --> 00:19:52.010
Emile Tompa: yeah
78
00:19:52.010 --> 00:20:04.849
Emile Tompa: got things under their belt already. So so we're taking that into consideration, the way we're developing the guidance to be sure that anybody can pick it up and and find themselves in it, and and get the the kind of
79
00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:16.150
Emile Tompa: best of practices of how to start the process formally, regards to what their context is. Right. So we're taking into consideration that context is a critical factor. And each journey is unique.
80
00:20:16.670 --> 00:20:21.019
Andy: Yeah, following on from what Emil said, I think it's important for the
81
00:20:21.170 --> 00:20:39.659
Andy: for the authors that each business can relate to it on some level, depending on what time, where they are in the process, and what they've accomplished, and and also that the tools that are provided. You know the appendices, and some of the things that are going to be provided in the guide
82
00:20:39.750 --> 00:20:54.440
Andy: to help businesses. Businesses flourish is the way that each of those tools can is are relatable, regardless of where they are in the process and what size they are. So I think it's important that we we
83
00:20:54.610 --> 00:21:09.949
Andy: look at the the guide from all those lenses, and so that any business, as a meal eloquently said, can pick it up and relate to it. And and it's usable for them. So it's practical as well as you know, relatable.
84
00:21:11.060 --> 00:21:38.050
Emile Tompa: Yeah. And and and just to carry on from that, it's really you articulate. Very well, Andy, I mean you. And I think Peter mentioned to one of the 1st things an organization may do and we're encouraging them to do is is doing kind of internal scan, of of assessing formally what their situation is, and where those priority gaps that need to be addressed. So the guidance is helping you do that, knowing that you're gonna maybe find something different than another organization picking it up. So so
85
00:21:38.050 --> 00:21:45.799
Emile Tompa: part of the front end is just contextualizing where you're at and what you need to prioritize. And and that's going to be very context. Specific.
86
00:21:46.650 --> 00:21:52.560
Andy: And also realizing that it's not one size, fits all, and everybody's journey to that point is different.
87
00:21:52.710 --> 00:21:54.440
Andy: And and.
88
00:21:54.440 --> 00:21:54.960
Peter: You know what.
89
00:21:54.970 --> 00:21:58.000
Andy: It may be different, moving forward as well.
90
00:21:58.490 --> 00:22:06.885
Peter: Yeah, one thing that that could be really interesting here. And this is more sort of a brainstorming idea. Here is that
91
00:22:07.270 --> 00:22:36.460
Peter: as Emil said in this presentation, the orientation of this standard is is to build an inclusive workplace. Right? So and it's that kind of systems approach. So it's not taking sort of disability issues as a single problem. I I don't really mean that. But a single challenge that you you wanna resolve. But taking that systems approach to inclusivity. So
92
00:22:37.210 --> 00:22:38.690
Peter: the meal.
93
00:22:39.010 --> 00:22:57.779
Peter: you talked about organizations already being in a certain place, but what we already having done some work and and maybe work for years. And I'm wondering how this might be different. A systems approach as opposed to a more transactional approach that people may have taken in the past. Yeah.
94
00:22:57.780 --> 00:23:18.630
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah, exactly what what the intent is both of the standard. I think in our implementation, guidance is creating a new normal where it is a different way of operating where, where, every time you're doing things, you're thinking about that disability. And so you, it becomes a new way of thinking and a new way of operating, so so that you're inclusive by design, so that
95
00:23:18.810 --> 00:23:41.110
Emile Tompa: people don't have to necessarily disclose, you know, because you provide the flexibility. You provide the the the supports people need. Because that's just. You know people. Everybody's different, too, as organizations are different. People are different. And and the way they work is different. And so you create that flexibility, that inclusivity from the front end.
96
00:23:41.110 --> 00:23:59.139
Peter: Yeah. And an organization might say, for example, well, we've been doing this for years. I mean, we're representative, that. Why? Why do we need to do anything different, and and being representative numbers wise, is very different than building a culture building a culture that has this this approach.
97
00:23:59.140 --> 00:24:00.020
Emile Tompa: Exactly.
98
00:24:01.550 --> 00:24:21.180
Francis: Great. Thank you for the response. I really like the comment about being a journey and the guidance being practical, you talked a little bit about measurement and evaluation. And I think this next question follow ups really well, why is the continued improvement important for the implementation of the standard.
99
00:24:23.150 --> 00:24:42.769
Emile Tompa: Maybe I'll start since I talked a little bit about it in the presentation, so I think I emphasize that you can't do it all, particularly if you're starting off right. And the notion that there's always something that can be done is really critical to there's always room for improvement. So wherever you are at in that journey.
100
00:24:42.770 --> 00:24:57.850
Emile Tompa: you know, if you're going through a cycle of making some improvements, you're biting off a chunk of the things that you think are really priority issues at that juncture, and you're setting some targets to address them.
101
00:24:57.850 --> 00:25:26.320
Emile Tompa: and you get all the resources in place and the people in place. And you review what? Where? You're currently at, what needs to be modified, what policies, programs, practices, whatever it might be. You set some goals of how the timeline you're going to give yourself to meet your targets, and then you implement that you measure, evaluate along the way. So that's a cycle, right? But there's always things to be done. The best organizations are always looking to do better. Right? So it's not about
102
00:25:26.400 --> 00:25:37.689
Emile Tompa: we've done it all so where, if we can. Just, you know, put it aside and not think about it anymore. The environment changes. You know, technology changes, the labor market changes. So you're always looking well.
103
00:25:37.990 --> 00:26:07.009
Emile Tompa: do we have the best approach currently in this space, in this and where there is room for improvement. And even when you're, you know, a role model employer. You're still looking for ways to do better, because there's always room for improvement. And so that's those cycles will have different things being addressed each round. But certainly you're looking to see. Well, where is there still, you know, priority things that we could do to fine tune and do better. So it's a it's a philosophy actually of how to.
104
00:26:07.220 --> 00:26:26.029
Emile Tompa: you know, be a best in class type organization, where you're always looking to do better. And so that continual improvement process. We've woven into each of our core modules in those modules that I described in the presentation. Each of them have a distinct continual improvement process built into them, so that you're not trying to
105
00:26:26.030 --> 00:26:38.900
Emile Tompa: bite off and chew and deal with everything at once. It's just not possible you take a component, and you set some goals and and you work in a certain period of time to achieve those goals before you think about what else can we do?
106
00:26:38.900 --> 00:26:47.640
Emile Tompa: And the periodicity of those cycles will depend, by the organization and its capacity and resources to to revisit these things on a periodic basis.
107
00:26:48.660 --> 00:27:02.249
Andy: I also think that the continuous improvement in a model that Neil, you know, articulated also, is important. That gives an opportunity and organize for an organization to reflect
108
00:27:02.520 --> 00:27:12.339
Andy: and have that pros and dialogue internally, but also at points externally, to look at ways that they they can.
109
00:27:12.570 --> 00:27:20.320
Andy: you know, if they go through a process, you know, having a means to say, you know, what did we do? Well, and what can we do better?
110
00:27:20.580 --> 00:27:28.410
Andy: And what resources can we tap into in order to be better? So it and it's always an evolving, and, if you like.
111
00:27:28.890 --> 00:27:47.629
Andy: excuse the expression. But a living process where it's always evolving. And and, as Emil said, you're always looking at ways to improve and evolve both as an organization and and within within your process of of trying to become more inclusive.
112
00:27:47.850 --> 00:27:54.460
Andy: Some individual, some organizations may feel that there's way. There's that they're they're already
113
00:27:54.770 --> 00:27:57.029
Andy: meeting some of their targets. But
114
00:27:57.490 --> 00:28:03.169
Andy: is there a need to move those targets and evolve those targets in any way to grow.
115
00:28:03.170 --> 00:28:03.630
Emile Tompa: Exactly.
116
00:28:03.630 --> 00:28:07.859
Andy: Both as an organization regardless of size, because.
117
00:28:07.860 --> 00:28:08.350
Emile Tompa: Yeah.
118
00:28:08.350 --> 00:28:15.579
Andy: Growth can mean different things to different people. So, having met measurable reflection of how that's achieved is important as well.
119
00:28:15.580 --> 00:28:26.549
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah, I see it as it kind of akin to like lifelong learning right? There's always more to be done, you know, if you set your mind to to doing better. There's there's always room for improvement.
120
00:28:27.290 --> 00:28:49.281
Peter: I wanted to pick up on a point that Andy made there, because, Andy, you talked about internal dialogue, and so far we haven't talked about. The fact that that's a really important part of the guidance is is the nothing about us without us principle. So you know right from the very beginning in terms of developing the policies, as
121
00:28:49.620 --> 00:29:13.729
Peter: Emil said. And then kind of all the way through. And there's obviously different interventions you can make there in terms of consultation, employee resource groups, or simply focus groups with employees. Again, that will that could depend on the size of your organization, but that continual improvement includes that kind of ongoing dialogue and engagement with
122
00:29:13.730 --> 00:29:40.400
Peter: key stakeholders, which will obviously include employees with disabilities and and many others right. Not to go off on a tangent, Emil, but you know, when you talk, talk about the the question of what we're calling in the standard accessibility supports right? We're moving away from the word accommodation and calling these supports. You know, those kind of workplace supports
123
00:29:40.400 --> 00:29:47.700
Peter: tend to meet a variety of needs for a variety of stakeholders. So that's where that dialogue would come in.
124
00:29:47.700 --> 00:30:06.850
Emile Tompa: Yeah. Yeah. Hugely important. What you mentioned there, Peter, particularly the nothing about us. Without us thing in general, this is meant to be each of these cycles and the teams involved. It needs to be a team. It's not a person's job. It needs to be a team with with people within the workplace, who bring different
125
00:30:07.090 --> 00:30:31.659
Emile Tompa: lived experiences, lends us to the table so that you had the benefit of that collective knowledge, kind of thing and experience. Kind of thing to to make sure it addresses the genuine needs of the workforce and is truly inclusive by design. And it's really absolutely critical that it's person centered. It's meant to make work for for people. Right? It's not like a
126
00:30:31.860 --> 00:30:39.510
Emile Tompa: administrative thing, right? It is. It's a person centered approach where it's a person approaches requires the people with the experience to be at the table.
127
00:30:39.670 --> 00:30:58.630
Peter: Yeah. And when I think again picking up on that, when you talk about inclusion, I mean, obviously, the standard is is meant to include one particular group of people. But I think you know that kind of lens of well, you know, how can we ensure our workplace is inclusive?
128
00:30:59.320 --> 00:31:05.179
Peter: A variety of groups inclusive of everybody. I think that that expands the scope of this a little bit.
129
00:31:06.450 --> 00:31:16.610
Andy: I also think, Peter, that one key thing is to to recognize that people with disabilities have multiple identities. You know, that intersect.
130
00:31:16.610 --> 00:31:18.230
Peter: Right? That's a good point.
131
00:31:18.230 --> 00:31:20.600
Andy: They can be, you know they
132
00:31:21.080 --> 00:31:23.569
Andy: it may be a simplified example, but somebody would.
133
00:31:24.070 --> 00:31:27.529
Andy: Disability can can have other identities that intersect.
134
00:31:28.255 --> 00:31:28.980
Peter: Right.
135
00:31:29.010 --> 00:31:32.679
Andy: That if that are who they are and
136
00:31:33.220 --> 00:31:45.190
Andy: their journey, and maybe of how they became an employee, you know, and they bring unique perspectives. That that should be valued. Within the dialogue.
137
00:31:45.530 --> 00:31:45.890
Peter: Okay.
138
00:31:45.890 --> 00:31:52.290
Andy: Just not just, not the disability, but also some other identities that may sure
139
00:31:52.290 --> 00:31:57.509
Andy: lead to to you know a unique contribution to that dialogue.
140
00:31:57.830 --> 00:32:13.000
Peter: Other identities and other supports. So I could be a person with a disability that requires childcare supports, for example. So I need some supports around that kind of flexibility. So that comes into the identities that you're talking about there, Andy.
141
00:32:13.000 --> 00:32:13.620
Emile Tompa: Exactly.
142
00:32:13.620 --> 00:32:14.500
Andy: For sure.
143
00:32:14.820 --> 00:32:15.430
Peter: Yeah.
144
00:32:15.430 --> 00:32:16.050
Emile Tompa: Cool.
145
00:32:16.390 --> 00:32:25.089
Francis: Great. We have quite a number of questions flooding in. So I'm gonna ask a 2 parts questions I think it'll be a good follow up here. So I
146
00:32:25.160 --> 00:32:52.040
Francis: there's a lot of people involved in the organization, depending on the sizes and and wondering like who should be responsible for the implementation who should be involved. And and also earlier on you mentioned about the system. Thinking, can you elaborate on what this approach is in relation to exclusive employment. I'm sorry, inclusive employment. Because this might be a bit of a new concept to some of the smaller organizations. Perhaps.
147
00:32:52.370 --> 00:32:54.414
Emile Tompa: Okay, do you want me to start?
148
00:32:54.670 --> 00:32:55.020
Peter: Go ahead!
149
00:32:55.020 --> 00:33:19.910
Emile Tompa: Okay? So so I mentioned the systems approach in in our in the the presentation part of it. And and that's really central to to how we're. We're taking this implementation guidance. And it's central, obviously to the standard as well. Because if we really want to create a new normal, that is just the way this organization operates by being inclusive by design, that it, this lenses inclusion, lenses taken to everything.
150
00:33:20.040 --> 00:33:34.580
Emile Tompa: You have to create a a new culture, of of how you operate, and everybody has to be part of that culture kind of thing. So historically, we would think of some of these things being just somebody's role. Somebody in Hr does accessibility, support, or accommodations.
151
00:33:34.870 --> 00:33:47.020
Emile Tompa: And then that person leaves right for another job and another agent. And you've lost that capacity because it's not integral to the way the organization operates. Right? It has to be woven into all facets of the organization.
152
00:33:47.230 --> 00:34:03.010
Emile Tompa: That's what inclusive by design means is is that it's the lens you take at the front end when you're procuring something, when you're hiring people, when you're when you're developing Hr policies. When you're developing operational policies, it's it's absolutely critical.
153
00:34:03.280 --> 00:34:30.099
Emile Tompa: And another critical thing is just senior management. Buy-in people have to believe and want this to be the way forward for them and give the resources needed to make this happen like the people. Time that need to be there at the table to operationalize the standard to implement it kind of thing. So the systems approach is critical for it to be sustainable. Right? That's what we're trying to think about. How do we create a normal.
154
00:34:30.150 --> 00:34:40.510
Emile Tompa: a new normal that is sustainable regardless of who comes and goes within the organization. And I think that it is the the essence of how that organization operates.
155
00:34:41.520 --> 00:34:45.760
Andy: Adding on to Amir's point, so did I cut you off, Peter? I'm sorry.
156
00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:48.290
Peter: No, go ahead, Nanny, and I'll Andy, I'll jump in after.
157
00:34:48.929 --> 00:34:50.849
Andy: Just thinking that
158
00:34:50.980 --> 00:35:08.589
Andy: as an example, it's got to really be interwoven within the tapestry of the organization from the top down. But then you've also got to be able to get buy-in from different departments. And as Peter said nothing about us without us principle, you have to engage people with disabilities with
159
00:35:08.700 --> 00:35:33.999
Andy: within your organization. To ensure that you know the lived experience concept is interwoven within the systems that you create. But then also you have to ensure that their their viewpoint is valued. And it's and they're integral to those systems. But they're the systems can operate independent of them. But so that they're not seen as
160
00:35:34.220 --> 00:35:45.989
Andy: as as the they're within the leadership group. But they're not seen as the reason for these systems to be created. It's it's sort of seen as an organizational change
161
00:35:46.460 --> 00:35:51.660
Andy: with a person centered approach in the systems you create. But the individual
162
00:35:53.000 --> 00:35:57.470
Andy: individual people aren't integral to the systems working.
163
00:35:57.610 --> 00:36:00.790
Andy: So the systems are able to be implemented
164
00:36:01.448 --> 00:36:04.500
Andy: with full buy-in. Throughout the organization.
165
00:36:05.350 --> 00:36:15.820
Peter: Yeah. So thanks for that, Andy. So just picking up on the 1st part of the question and elaborated on that again, elaborating a little bit more in terms of kind of who should be involved and who's
166
00:36:15.990 --> 00:36:39.689
Peter: who's responsible? I mean? We're writing the guidance from the point of view that management needs to take that leadership role. So senior management needs to take that leadership role. And and there's certain level of top down on in this in terms of, you know, managers need to kind of do their thing in terms of bringing bringing this to to happen.
167
00:36:40.081 --> 00:36:51.049
Peter: But but really it's it's buy in from through throughout the organization. So going back to that 1st point that Emil showed in the deck about
168
00:36:51.250 --> 00:36:58.121
Peter: creating a disability strategy that that's a great way to have buy in right? So
169
00:36:59.041 --> 00:37:22.110
Peter: engaging people in both the development of that strategy and then making sure that people throughout the organization know. Okay, this is where we're going on these issues. in terms of that strategy. So it, it really, it becomes kind of everybody's business. If you're gonna build a culture right? So that.
170
00:37:22.280 --> 00:37:30.719
Emile Tompa: I really like that. It's everybody's business. Because I wanted to emphasize the fact that everybody plays a role. There's different roles right? Senior
171
00:37:31.040 --> 00:37:43.810
Emile Tompa: buy in, and culture comes from top down oftentimes. But everybody plays a role. If you're a people manager, how do you? How do you work with your team in in a way that's inclusive of everybody on your team and their different needs and ability
172
00:37:44.170 --> 00:38:07.320
Emile Tompa: to really tap into that talent. But it's actually a win-win. You have better levels of engagement when you know how to address the diversity of needs and styles kind of thing. But as a colleague, you know, when you communicate with others. You know you have to play. Be respectful of different ways of communicating and being sure they're included that kind of thing. So we all play a role. And the systems approach really emphasizes that
173
00:38:07.320 --> 00:38:16.739
Emile Tompa: you can't say, Oh, that's somebody else's job. I'm responsible. No, we all play a role different roles, right? But but and that has to be spelled out. Who's responsible for what and who are the key?
174
00:38:16.740 --> 00:38:21.889
Emile Tompa: This is different parts, but but it has to be very clear that we all contribute to the process.
175
00:38:22.140 --> 00:38:49.080
Peter: Yeah, because if you shift it all onto one person, say, or departments such as the Hr department, it's not gonna happen right. They won't have the capacity. They won't have the resources. They won't be able to build that culture. You you can ask them to do certain things you can ask them to, I don't know. Go out and and and recruit, or you can ask them, maybe, to review your policies and practices. But you you may not build a culture that way.
176
00:38:49.080 --> 00:38:58.080
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, no, that. That's sometimes the worst thing I find. At least, if you say, Oh, go to hr, they deal with that. That's a customary thing that we've done in the past. So it's
177
00:38:58.420 --> 00:39:12.149
Emile Tompa: I'm in operations. You go with. Hr. They'll they'll help, you know. We we all play a role. You can't be dismissive like that. You have to know that if you're a people manager wherever you sit, you know you're you play a key role in making sure people's needs are met.
178
00:39:12.590 --> 00:39:39.499
Andy: I really like the point Peter made about. You know, strategy, you know. Strategic planning is huge in in small and large organizations, and if, if the continuous improvement and inclusion can be integrated within that strategic plan, it, it really creates a vision and vision for an organization. So and that's how you get long term buy-in.
179
00:39:39.500 --> 00:39:40.080
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah.
180
00:39:40.080 --> 00:39:43.920
Andy: If it's in interwoven within the strategic planning documents.
181
00:39:43.920 --> 00:39:44.330
Peter: Yeah.
182
00:39:44.868 --> 00:39:55.629
Andy: Not necessarily always as a a separate strategy. But if there's if the the continuous improvement movement and
183
00:39:55.740 --> 00:40:03.159
Andy: the you know, a culture of inclusion is is interwoven within the strategic planning. It really helps.
184
00:40:03.160 --> 00:40:03.600
Peter: Okay.
185
00:40:03.600 --> 00:40:07.350
Andy: The buy-in that that the 2 other panelists spoke about
186
00:40:08.406 --> 00:40:14.929
Andy: in depth, you know, because it creates that vision for the organization long term, whether it's large or small.
187
00:40:15.530 --> 00:40:16.070
Emile Tompa: Yeah.
188
00:40:16.750 --> 00:40:27.360
Emile Tompa: definitely. I I it has to be intentional right in that. It's a plan. It's not ad hoc. You know. You don't put out fires you intentionally move forward proactively, and and have a plan.
189
00:40:27.790 --> 00:40:48.739
Peter: Yeah. And one, maybe one last point on this. And I was kind of thinking about this earlier this morning is that standards are by design, technical. And indeed, there's a technical committee that's been set up for the the standard. But this is as much of an art as it is a science. Right? So when you're trying to build culture.
190
00:40:48.740 --> 00:41:04.870
Peter: you can't really go about that scientifically, that's the importance of a strategic plan to outline what that vision is because, as much as this is technical, it remains an art about how to build an inclusive culture.
191
00:41:05.260 --> 00:41:06.149
Emile Tompa: Definitely, yeah.
192
00:41:06.150 --> 00:41:08.869
Peter: Some of it has to come organically depending on.
193
00:41:09.320 --> 00:41:15.949
Andy: The purpose of the organization and their goals as well. Like there's there's not a formula of how it's created
194
00:41:16.100 --> 00:41:29.190
Andy: within every organization, some of it, or will organically develop as a result of of that, that beginning process of starting to develop a system to implement.
195
00:41:29.190 --> 00:41:47.350
Emile Tompa: Yeah, exactly. I I do think culture can submit. You're getting by the intentionality of looking to make progress in this space. Right? So so it's really critical that that that everybody's working in the same direction and wanting to make change, that makes the workplace more inclusive.
196
00:41:49.000 --> 00:42:16.629
Francis: Thank you. I like the comment about how everyone can play a role. And and you mentioned about buying. I think we're getting to a bit of a nitty gritty. Now, the questions I have here from the audience is that what if this isn't a case where a senior leader is very resistant on doing this line of work, and and they just want to do the bare minimum and and see. This may be disruptive even to their work like, what would your advice be, and where to start.
197
00:42:19.192 --> 00:42:21.439
Emile Tompa: Andy, you go ahead.
198
00:42:21.440 --> 00:42:44.769
Andy: I I just take. I'll take a shot at it. I think I think part of it is through education. I think the only way that we, one of the ways we create changes to education and through knowledge. And I. So I think, even at a senior level, you can always learn to make your organization better. So it's being able to connect with the community.
199
00:42:44.780 --> 00:43:02.599
Andy: Yeah, interact with people lived experience, see their journey through the employment process through the employment lifecycle find a way that because we can all relate to each other as humans, right? So finding a way that the senior leader can
200
00:43:03.075 --> 00:43:17.660
Andy: rel relate to team members and and and and see see how they can make their organization better by creating inclusive environments. So if if they're looking at it from an economical
201
00:43:18.100 --> 00:43:37.762
Andy: viewpoint, how can we create a larger client base by being more inclusive? You know, how can we, you know, finding a way. When I used to do the systemic work with investigations in one of my previous roles, it was finding a way that each person, when coming together for these systemic goals?
202
00:43:38.220 --> 00:44:05.939
Andy: would. How can you create a situation where they can get a sense of the other person's view and and getting getting sort of the how can you change the lens at the way they're looking at it? And how can you relate to them as, and allow them to grow as an individual, and ultimately their organization, to grow and be a better citizen within the community and create a more inclusive environment for all.
203
00:44:06.020 --> 00:44:12.149
Andy: so that might be a wishy, washy answer. But I think ultimately it has to be, you know.
204
00:44:12.240 --> 00:44:18.939
Andy: person, some personal growth, but then some all also organizational growth. And how can the organization
205
00:44:19.210 --> 00:44:25.230
Andy: be a be a better member within their sector and be a leader rather than a follower?
206
00:44:26.670 --> 00:44:30.690
Emile Tompa: Yeah. And code that, too. I mean, I I think
207
00:44:30.730 --> 00:44:39.642
Emile Tompa: everybody maybe comes to the table with with different priors, kind of thing. But for senior leadership. I think the important thing to real for them to realize is,
208
00:44:39.950 --> 00:45:03.620
Emile Tompa: that it's a win-win right? It's in your organization's interest to go down this journey. It creates higher levels of engagement. It opens up talent pools that you may be struggling to recruit people for. And it's just that, you know you want to be the leader in your class in your sector. If you want to be the best in class.
209
00:45:03.810 --> 00:45:27.719
Emile Tompa: have a great client base that you know, 27% of persons people in Canada identify as a person with disabilities. So it's not a marginal group. It's quite a large segment of our society. So if we operate in a way that that is inclusive, not just over the workforce, but of our client base kind of thing. It's a huge win-win for organizations, I think, and I think someone who may be apprehensive, maybe if you can
210
00:45:28.000 --> 00:45:34.447
Emile Tompa: present to them that I guess sometimes they describe as a business case, but that there is a a genuine
211
00:45:34.960 --> 00:45:44.770
Emile Tompa: financial bottom line or operational performance issues that that are also some of the outcomes of these of these, this process that that might
212
00:45:45.060 --> 00:46:07.990
Emile Tompa: be a starting point for people to realize. Okay, how can we do better? And how can that actually, then, ultimately give us some of those opportunities to to improve the levels of engagement and improve the diversity of our of our workforce and our client base. I mean, you need to do this. If this is like more than 25% of of our population. If you're, gonna
213
00:46:08.480 --> 00:46:10.600
Emile Tompa: you know, a leader in your class.
214
00:46:11.320 --> 00:46:30.789
Andy: I really like how Emil said it was a win win, you know, and for any organization they want to be following best practices and not falling behind their competitors on all, all levels. And, as Emil said, you know the there's an untapped labor pool there that that if if you're not
215
00:46:30.950 --> 00:46:37.499
Andy: following best practices you miss out on which is not good for the health of your organization and overall
216
00:46:37.610 --> 00:46:45.480
Andy: for you to implement a a meaningful system for your organization. So really, by not not
217
00:46:46.055 --> 00:46:48.899
Andy: being in favor of this, you you are.
218
00:46:49.470 --> 00:46:55.610
Andy: You are falling behind, falling behind honestly. And you know
219
00:46:55.790 --> 00:47:01.050
Andy: that's not good as a leader either. You want to be at the forefront rather than being reactive.
220
00:47:03.430 --> 00:47:04.250
Francis: Great.
221
00:47:04.400 --> 00:47:05.360
Francis: Thank you.
222
00:47:07.470 --> 00:47:27.190
Francis: Earlier in the presentation, you talk a little bit of the development of the implementation guidance and the diverse team that was involved. Our audience is curious about if there's any specific resources or examples or cases that we use to help inform the development of the guidance, and where they may be able to learn more about those.
223
00:47:30.700 --> 00:47:32.589
Emile Tompa: Yeah, Andy, do you want to take that? And I'll.
224
00:47:32.940 --> 00:47:36.360
Andy: Sure. I think we we used.
225
00:47:36.480 --> 00:48:01.339
Andy: you know, in environmental scan. We used a lot of case studies to inform our knowledge in. In drafting the guide. And I. My understanding is that they're going to be examples for businesses and and case studies and meaningful real life examples that large and small businesses are able to apply within the guide itself. So
226
00:48:01.570 --> 00:48:02.740
Andy: we've used
227
00:48:03.340 --> 00:48:15.679
Andy: you know, real life examples, and also our intellectual property of the committee and our lived experience to inform the guide. But, we're not pretending that
228
00:48:15.770 --> 00:48:35.179
Andy: we are, you know. We know every situation that a business might be in but we're hoping that the examples that are provided within the guide can be relatable to to all on some level, and you know, it can be used as a starting point and allow a business to grow
229
00:48:35.560 --> 00:48:42.209
Andy: in implementing some of the systems and continual improvement mechanisms that Emil spoke about earlier.
230
00:48:42.210 --> 00:49:05.280
Emile Tompa: Yeah. And I just wanna add that just a lot of the work that many of us are involved in within idea and beyond we've done. We've been in this space for quite a number of years, and we so we've done a lot of just key informant interviews around you know, promising practices and recruitment, hiring onboarding, mentorship and advancement. You know, studies around you know how to
231
00:49:05.280 --> 00:49:34.439
Emile Tompa: package job opportunities to make sure it works for the diversity of talent in the labor market we've done work on. We're doing work on procurement best practices within idea as well. So we're drawing on tapping into a rich set of work we've done in the past, within idea and beyond, and many of the people on our team have worked in this space for a number of years, and then, as we mentioned, and I'm not sure if people caught it
232
00:49:34.440 --> 00:49:40.039
Emile Tompa: once, we have a Beta draft. We also want to get feedback from others. Right? I mean.
233
00:49:40.790 --> 00:50:03.360
Emile Tompa: we. There's things we might have missed, because obviously everybody brings something new to the table. So we really want to hear from others about areas that could be fine, tuned, improved, you know. Other things they'd like to see. Case examples are are really hugely helpful. Andy touched on those. And that's something we we want to do, too, so that it seems grounded and tangible. When you see
234
00:50:03.712 --> 00:50:31.690
Emile Tompa: examples of how organizations have done it, you know, in in their context, it it can be inspiring, but also give you some idea. Oh, we can do that, too. Doesn't sound so complicated. That kind of thing. So we'll we'll draw on whatever we can get out there. That's already been done to help support it. And one of the things we're actually doing is is doing quite an extensive review of tools and resources already out there that that will help support the process, and we'll point to them in our in our annexes.
235
00:50:32.460 --> 00:50:44.140
Andy: And the one other point that Emil brought up is, you know, the standard we went through quite a consultation with with public, and, as Emil mentioned, where we want to do, consult
236
00:50:44.170 --> 00:51:13.930
Andy: some consultation in relation to the guide, and hear from you as to as to what we're doing, and if we're if there's gaps within within the research. But, as Emil said, we, we there is an esteemed group of individuals that I'm honored to work with, that are working on the the guide. So we're hoping that we can hit all the major points, and with the consultation that any nuances that we might have missed can be included as a result of the beta that that we're gonna hope
237
00:51:14.470 --> 00:51:16.600
Andy: will be made available.
238
00:51:19.460 --> 00:51:20.330
Francis: I see.
239
00:51:22.000 --> 00:51:45.759
Francis: So the implementation guidance related to the the employment standards, and our audience is wondering if the guidance will also have some specific details related to, you know, certain scenarios that happens to the workplaces. So an example is given here is that it's in relation to accessibility, supports or accommodation. So
240
00:51:45.950 --> 00:52:10.249
Francis: you know, when they're hybrid workers and employers may only kind of provide the accessibility supports to when they're at the office or at home, only depending on which place that they work. Perhaps the majority of their time, so will the guidance have any specific details regarding those kind of requirements, and and how to go about doing that.
241
00:52:12.400 --> 00:52:32.290
Emile Tompa: Good. That's very good question. The way we're approaching it, and and I'll touch on on that and others. Andy and Peter may want to elaborate is we're we're giving some pointers of things to look for, you know, flexible work arrangements, you know. Time, flexibility. Should you know where you
242
00:52:32.290 --> 00:52:53.579
Emile Tompa: where you where you work at home, you know, in the workplace whatever. So there's some some obvious pointers that we can give people as things to look for as you're going through a cycle right? Ultimately the choices will be made by the team within the organization that that's tasked with with doing a particular cycle. But certainly we want to give them a starting point. The standard itself
243
00:52:53.600 --> 00:53:16.079
Emile Tompa: gives a lot of indications of the kinds of things you need to think about right technologies, communications, you know, flexibility. You know, there's a lot of, you know, obvious areas that need to be for a starting point. And we'll give as many of those kinds of pointers as possible, and and hopefully, maybe some of the annexes can can elaborate on some of those details that we think are particularly critical.
244
00:53:17.130 --> 00:53:44.189
Peter: Yeah, so I can jump in there. So it's it's hard to get down to the the nitty gritty of everything. So obviously we can't cover every single workplace scenario. But we may give some scenarios, for example, some some sort of case studies. As Emil said, we'll point to other resources as well. So maybe particular organizations or resources regard regarding accessibility supports.
245
00:53:44.559 --> 00:53:56.110
Peter: One of the things that we haven't really touched on so far is the idea of compliance. So, although it's a volunt voluntary standard, we're writing it from the point of view of
246
00:53:56.700 --> 00:54:19.779
Peter: of, here's how to be compliant with the standard, and we we recognize that some employers may be operating in a jurisdiction in which they need to be compliant with other pieces of legislation, such as the aota in Ontario, and the other provincial acts, such as BC. And other places. So there is a there's a tie into compliance. And
247
00:54:19.780 --> 00:54:29.602
Peter: this kind of relates both to this question and the question of of see lack of senior management buy in so
248
00:54:30.130 --> 00:54:58.429
Peter: we're we're not. How do I put this? We're not writing the standard or or sorry this guidance, from the point of view of a large stick to wield for people to follow. We're probably giving more carrots than sticks. But compliance will come into it, depending on the jurisdiction that some organizations find themselves in.
249
00:54:58.790 --> 00:55:02.169
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah, definitely, we need to be sympathetic towards
250
00:55:02.280 --> 00:55:08.580
Emile Tompa: requirements in different jurisdiction. And I think the standard itself has been written with with an eye to that.
251
00:55:08.948 --> 00:55:32.560
Emile Tompa: So so we I mentioned, I think, reporting being an important part of what we're recommending, and that could be voluntary, or maybe in some cases a requirement. But certainly we really believe it's important to report internally, but also externally, a lot of organizations will be very proud of what they're doing. While even on their website, I think the accessible Canada Act
252
00:55:32.560 --> 00:55:41.909
Emile Tompa: requires you to do that with your accessibility, planning and reporting as well to make it a public document. So there are various layers of things we need to take into consideration, as we recommend how
253
00:55:42.010 --> 00:55:48.980
Emile Tompa: best to to weave this into the way you're operating and building in those continue improvement process. How do you get
254
00:55:49.530 --> 00:55:58.449
Emile Tompa: voluntarily compliant with the standard? Then keep in mind also these these other things that that you you're required to do within your jurisdiction.
255
00:55:59.750 --> 00:56:00.490
Francis: Great.
256
00:56:00.890 --> 00:56:25.710
Francis: We're almost at the end of our time now, and I want to just point out that I've noticed that Rebecca on the team has been helping to answer a couple of the questions that are in the Q. And a. So thank you very much, and I encourage folks to check that out. And maybe we can take one real, very quick last question. So talk a little bit about resources and journey, and where organizations.
257
00:56:25.860 --> 00:56:44.940
Francis: maybe at different stages. So in terms of next step, would the guidance also contain? You know, tools that would help organization to actually scan their own environment and and and find out where they are. So that they can kind of plan their their next step in in the process.
258
00:56:46.370 --> 00:56:46.870
Andy: All right.
259
00:56:47.703 --> 00:56:49.370
Emile Tompa: I'll start.
260
00:56:49.370 --> 00:57:14.015
Andy: Oh, I I was just gonna say that I it is our intention to include audit tools and allow organizations to to sort of choose in a way, choose your own adventure. You know. Where? Where do you want to start? And where do you want to get to? And how do you want to achieve it. And what are you doing at this point? But I'll but I'll I'll hand them Mike over to Emil.
261
00:57:14.340 --> 00:57:35.100
Emile Tompa: You said exactly what I was going to say. Like audit tools are a very common thing for for implementing standards, and sometimes they check off lists. But there are means to. And there's different ways. You can collect the data, the knowledge in your scan of the environment within your workplace. Conversations with people really help talk to the people. What.
262
00:57:35.280 --> 00:57:53.329
Emile Tompa: what, what are there? The challenges that they have? You know. What are the things that they see need to be addressed, you know. Ask them what they think is most urgently. They needed that kind of thing. So that's that's an audit of a different sort. But you some organizations. It would maybe more formal, and have questionnaires, anonymous ones that get sent out. You know.
263
00:57:53.330 --> 00:58:08.350
Emile Tompa: health and safety questionnaire and inclusive employment questionnaire like we get some feedback from people and get a sense of what the consensus is of the key gaps that need to need to be addressed. But but audit shows of some sort.
264
00:58:08.675 --> 00:58:19.420
Emile Tompa: We'll, we'll be critical for helping you collect the relevant knowledge intelligence about what's the lay of the land currently in your organization, so we'll be providing some of those with the Annexes.
265
00:58:19.820 --> 00:58:36.715
Peter: Yeah, that's a great question in terms of scanning tools. I mean, we've obviously started to point to different data sets. For example, like statistics, Canada, and so on in terms of data that you you might wanna use to to do your scan. But
266
00:58:37.060 --> 00:58:57.870
Peter: you you mentioned surveys. Emil. That's a really great way of scanning your organization to see where you're at. But you know, I think I think we could put some more thought into that front end in terms of here's how to scan your organization and and where you want to go to get those tools. It's a it's a great question.
267
00:58:58.710 --> 00:59:02.129
Andy: It'll it also allows you to. Sorry, Emil, did I cut you off again?
268
00:59:02.130 --> 00:59:03.119
Emile Tompa: No, go! Go for it.
269
00:59:03.730 --> 00:59:04.340
Andy: Just
270
00:59:04.520 --> 00:59:09.950
Andy: also allowing the organization to develop their own thought map of how they're gonna get there. You know.
271
00:59:10.470 --> 00:59:13.989
Andy: And individualize it a little bit, depending on their sector and their needs.
272
00:59:13.990 --> 00:59:15.260
Andy: This is an organization
273
00:59:15.260 --> 00:59:24.739
Andy: not just size, you know, we we talk about large and small, but also what sector are they in? What are their goals of their organization? And what thought map? Do they want to create.
274
00:59:24.740 --> 00:59:25.330
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah.
275
00:59:25.330 --> 00:59:26.879
Andy: Part of their strategic plan.
276
00:59:26.880 --> 00:59:27.269
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah.
277
00:59:27.270 --> 00:59:30.830
Andy: Being able to individualize. You know the journey to get there.
278
00:59:30.830 --> 01:00:00.469
Emile Tompa: Yeah, the the other thing I wanted to add it just touched. From what Peter said in my mind about we haven't talked a whole lot about benchmarking. And how well are we doing relative and a lot of organizations for some reason, need that the comparison thing to give them a sense of? Are we? Are we in the right place? Or, you know, relative to our peers? And are we? Are we? Are we making progress kind of thing, not just within organization measurement, evaluation. But you know, in benchmarking with others. So so we'll need to think about how going forward. Some of that
279
01:00:00.480 --> 01:00:19.069
Emile Tompa: kind of intelligence can be gathered, whether it's statistics, Canada data to tell you. Well, in in our labor market this is the lay of the land in terms of persons with lived experience, kind of thing? Or does our organization represent that that labor market or not that kind of thing. So there's various ways to think about benchmarking.
280
01:00:19.730 --> 01:00:33.929
Peter: And when you do your strategic plan normally, you're gonna be doing some kind of environmental scan as well. So it's once we get to that portion. I think you know, talking about a little bit more about environmental scans, and how you do that could.
281
01:00:33.930 --> 01:00:34.430
Emile Tompa: Shit.
282
01:00:34.430 --> 01:00:35.379
Peter: Very well. There.
283
01:00:35.380 --> 01:00:48.609
Emile Tompa: Yeah, one of the things I want to mention about the Q&A stuff. Just we, we are going to make that available to folks. There was some from our the last session we had to that we'll be responding to and making that available through our idea website.
284
01:00:49.740 --> 01:00:59.579
Francis: Great. Well, thank you, Emil, Peter and Andy, for the very informative session. I'm personally looking forward to the Beta version coming up.
285
01:01:00.377 --> 01:01:19.249
Francis: So a reminder to our audience that the recording and the transcriptions of today's session will be made available on our website, and we'll be taking a short break for the Webinar Speaker Series during the summer months as well. So we'll resume in September. So stay tuned
286
01:01:19.750 --> 01:01:47.139
Francis: and at the meantime, you know, reach out to us. You can email email us at info at vraie dash idea.ca, and if you have any questions or suggestions about webinars. Topics. You know, definitely. Let us know and also follow us on various social media. Accounts as well. So I hope everyone has a pleasant rest of the day and the summer, and we'll see you in a few months.
287
01:01:48.260 --> 01:01:49.050
Emile Tompa: Thanks. Everyone.
288
01:01:49.050 --> 01:01:49.700
Peter: Thanks. Everyone.
289
01:01:49.700 --> 01:01:50.300
Andy: Thank you.
290
01:01:50.300 --> 01:01:50.960
Francis: I know.
291
01:02:14.650 --> 01:02:16.290
Peter: Andy! Emil, are you still here.
292
01:02:16.470 --> 01:02:16.800
Emile Tompa: Yep.
293
01:02:16.800 --> 01:02:17.610
Andy: Yes.
294
01:02:17.910 --> 01:02:20.430
Emile Tompa: We're just waiting for everybody to leave.
295
01:02:20.620 --> 01:02:21.180
Peter: Yeah.
296
01:02:33.510 --> 01:02:38.079
Emile Tompa: Yeah, I've removed everybody, the ones that were lingering
297
01:02:38.570 --> 01:02:41.499
Emile Tompa: anyways. You guys are great, amazing.
298
01:02:41.770 --> 01:02:59.720
Peter: That that went really? Well, I'm sorry I lost you guys for about 5 min. My, I didn't realize when I moved my computer this morning that it it, the power cable, came on, plugged, and all of a sudden I had no power. So so I was. I was absent for about 5 min. But yeah, I thought it turned out really well.
299
01:02:59.720 --> 01:03:04.680
Rebecca: We noticed we noticed answers me to go comment. So you were missed.
300
01:03:05.450 --> 01:03:09.750
Emile Tompa: Where did you go like? It wasn't a question too tough, and you left it for us to deal with.
301
01:03:10.077 --> 01:03:13.835
Peter: Now it's not ready to answer that. So yeah.
302
01:03:14.100 --> 01:03:16.540
Andy: About the buy in from senior leadership.
303
01:03:16.770 --> 01:03:20.240
Emile Tompa: Yeah. Well, that's why it's true that the really tough questions.
304
01:03:20.240 --> 01:03:26.272
Peter: That's why I threw in that compliance one to talk about senior management. When I finally came back.
305
01:03:27.370 --> 01:03:31.410
Emile Tompa: Yeah, no, it was a great conversation is for your really great.
306
01:03:31.410 --> 01:03:32.560
Francis: Blending.
307
01:03:32.560 --> 01:03:35.609
Emile Tompa: Our questions with the ones from the audience. It was really smooth.
308
01:03:37.040 --> 01:03:37.570
Francis: Yeah, I think.
309
01:03:37.570 --> 01:03:38.839
Emile Tompa: That was good. That was really.
310
01:03:38.840 --> 01:03:39.730
Peter: Yeah, that one.
311
01:03:39.730 --> 01:03:40.150
Francis: Yeah.
312
01:03:40.150 --> 01:03:46.210
Andy: I thought it went. I thought it went really well, and we we complimented. Sorry I cut you off there a couple of times a meal.
313
01:03:46.210 --> 01:03:47.479
Emile Tompa: No, no, no, me, it's me.
314
01:03:47.480 --> 01:03:52.319
Emile Tompa: Yeah, just always, you know, jumping in there right away too quickly, like a jackrabbit. No sorry about that.
315
01:03:52.560 --> 01:03:59.889
Andy: That's all good. I just you know, I but I thought I thought that it went really well, and I thought the questions
316
01:04:00.030 --> 01:04:02.329
Andy: we're really good. So.
317
01:04:02.330 --> 01:04:08.020
Emile Tompa: It was a it was a good mix. I thought the balance, you know, of of everybody's getting chance to speak, and.
318
01:04:08.020 --> 01:04:08.480
Peter: Sure.
319
01:04:08.480 --> 01:04:11.639
Emile Tompa: Their expertise and stuff like that. I think that shows
320
01:04:11.990 --> 01:04:16.590
Emile Tompa: for the audience to realize the the knowledge base that we have here working on the team.
321
01:04:17.040 --> 01:04:39.380
Rebecca: Some good ideas, I think, from the from the from the delegate, from the people attending but I think we should keep in mind as we go forward like, I think this the case scenarios and the tools. Well, our work will never be done, of course, that we can maybe continue to add some of those practical tools and guidelines.
322
01:04:39.840 --> 01:04:40.750
Peter: Really good ideas. There.
323
01:04:40.750 --> 01:04:45.990
Emile Tompa: Yeah, that was really great. And I kept thinking, Okay, well, well, we'll keep adding things over time. It's not going to ever.
324
01:04:45.990 --> 01:04:46.350
Peter: Again.
325
01:04:46.546 --> 01:04:51.249
Emile Tompa: But I didn't want to mention that, because we already have a lot of work to do that I want to give ourselves more.
326
01:04:51.620 --> 01:04:59.020
Andy: Yeah, I thought it was interesting that there seem to be a a real desire for like tools and things. So maybe we have.
327
01:04:59.870 --> 01:05:02.097
Andy: Examples and things.
328
01:05:03.380 --> 01:05:21.279
Emile Tompa: And I mentioned about something that we're doing, and Francis is very active in in sort of actually spearheading it. Is is a scan of tools and resources that we're we're contextualizing and putting up on our website stuff from other people, and that we want to profile because it fits in with this space?
329
01:05:21.280 --> 01:05:21.720
Emile Tompa: Yeah?
330
01:05:21.720 --> 01:05:29.069
Emile Tompa: And just so that it's in one place rather than you have to find it yourself and spend hours on the Internet trying.
331
01:05:29.600 --> 01:05:35.820
Emile Tompa: Where we're helping kind of build up that that compendium of of knowledge in 1 1 place to help with navigation.
332
01:05:35.820 --> 01:05:52.160
Peter: Yeah. So 2 of the questions were around resisting change. And that's something that we haven't talked about so far in our meetings is is, how do you deal with in this case? It was a senior manager and another case. It was a manager. Right? You didn't wanna do is resisting work workplace.
333
01:05:52.160 --> 01:06:00.350
Emile Tompa: And that's a really important thing. We have to think all the time, and then not everybody's gonna be, you know, buying in 100%.
334
01:06:00.350 --> 01:06:01.370
Emile Tompa: Yeah, with exactly
335
01:06:01.370 --> 01:06:08.160
Emile Tompa: change. Right? Change is scary for lots of people. And and rethinking how you work is is scary. Right? So.
336
01:06:08.160 --> 01:06:13.480
Rebecca: And the resistance might come from the bot like it might come from other coworkers and stuff.
337
01:06:13.480 --> 01:06:13.840
Emile Tompa: Yeah.
338
01:06:13.840 --> 01:06:16.320
Rebecca: Resistance is an issue, right?
339
01:06:16.320 --> 01:06:16.860
Emile Tompa: Yeah, yeah.
340
01:06:17.450 --> 01:06:28.719
Emile Tompa: yeah. And and so that, yeah, I'm not sure I have a solution for that may. Maybe you folks do. But maybe some of the culture stuff will have things that you know, training and stuff like that that might help.
341
01:06:28.720 --> 01:06:29.900
Peter: Yeah, well, I think.
342
01:06:29.900 --> 01:06:30.900
Emile Tompa: On board.
343
01:06:30.900 --> 01:06:35.739
Peter: Yeah, I mean, we we need to include something in there about change management, you know, basically change.
344
01:06:35.740 --> 01:06:37.580
Emile Tompa: Yeah, that's true. Yeah. Good point.
345
01:06:37.870 --> 01:06:38.660
Rebecca: Yeah.
346
01:06:38.660 --> 01:06:47.843
Rebecca: I'm gonna have to go. But I think you guys did a fantastic job. I hope I answered the question. I really tried to be as accurate as I could.
347
01:06:48.541 --> 01:07:14.780
Rebecca: there were a few I was a little uncertain about. But I think I did. Okay. And I think we have some people who are clearly watching and waiting, and that's really great. I think we'll get good feedback when we release the draft. But I wonder, I wonder about the idea of having, like a phase one which is the guidance that we're working on, but a phase 2 which might be which might require more work, maybe more funding and focus on practical guidelines.
348
01:07:15.350 --> 01:07:16.690
Emile Tompa: Yeah, okay.
349
01:07:16.690 --> 01:07:17.030
Peter: Yeah.
350
01:07:17.030 --> 01:07:24.209
Emile Tompa: Yeah, I agree. Okay, I have to get going to. I didn't have another meeting lined up right back to back to this thing. Okay, thanks. Everybody have a great one.
351
01:07:24.210 --> 01:07:25.180
Peter: Everyone, you too.
352
01:07:25.180 --> 01:07:25.800
Rebecca: Bye, everyone.
353
01:07:25.800 --> 01:07:26.580
Peter: Thank God!
354
01:07:27.348 --> 01:07:29.260
Therese Salenieks: Everyone that's really great.
355
01:07:29.260 --> 01:07:29.820
Francis: Yep.
Speakers
Emile Tompa is a Senior Scientist at the Institute for Work & Health (IWH), a not-for-profit organization that conducts and shares research to support policy-makers, employers and workers in creating healthy, safe and inclusive work environments. A labour and heath economist, Tompa holds appointments as Associate Professor in the Department of Economics at McMaster University and as Assistant Professor at the Dalla Lana School of Public Health at the University of Toronto. He is Executive Director of IDEA and co-lead of IDEA’s Hub 1, Workplace Systems and Partnerships.
Andy Livingston is the CEO of Dexterity Consulting. He is passionate about making dispute resolution accessible for all. His expertise, mediation skills and work on accessibility and accommodation issues are highly sought after.
Peter Field
Host
Dan Samosh is an Assistant Professor in Employment Relation at Queen’s University and Academic Co-Lead of the IDEA Incubator Hub on Transitions to Work and Career Development.
About the IDEA Speaker Series
The IDEA Speaker Series provides an opportunity to hear guest speakers talk about their efforts to create stronger and more diverse labour markets that include persons with disabilities.
